An Argument for Soccer

Please enjoy this email, I know I did...


Zach Garrison kicks it off...

I had to send a message because tweeting sucks.

Profilet, you are a jingoistic, right-wing American idiot ... so I know you will never like soccer on principle, just like all the other rednecks out there... but unfortunately for you, your demographic is, literally, becoming a minority in the United States.

Now, I have my Master's degree, which means I am more highly educated than all of you... I just needed to say that.

Yes, Adam, people have been saying that soccer would be the next big thing for a while now. But, it can't happen overnight, it CAN happen incrementally. Since 1994, when we hosted our first cup and started the MLS, soccer has grown by leaps and bounds. The four of us are living proof: In a small town in rural Missouri we all played soccer at least for a few years growing up. Pat and I played high school and Pat played college. Now, some of the best athletes in jackson play soccer, which is why my brothers club team is ranked 10th in the state.

major evidence:

-ESPN has invested more money in this World Cup than any other sporting event this year. Soccer haters like Colin Cowherd and Bill Simmons ( who used to berate soccer) now, all of a sudden, think soccer is great. Why???? MONEY!!! lots and lots of young people in America like to watch soccer. the video game FIFA Soccer outsells all EA sports games except for Madden, and FIFA is gaining on Madden by the way. ESPN just recently bought the rights to show every single British Premiere League game.. why Mr Profilet...MONEY$$!!

-What's the fastest growing demographic in the US??? middle aged white guys from Arkansas?? nope, sorry Republican Party. Its Latino Americans. What sport do they love -SOCCER, by far... not even close.

-This next point is kinda hard to make but... what sport do middle class suburban white kids play? basketball? no, watching the NCAA or NBA is evidence of that. Baseball? yes, but that has always been the case. Football? look at any major college or nfl team and notice that African Americans are vastly over represented and far outnumber whites. So basically, this is a racial/class argument: Soccer is more accessible to both the poorer latino american youth as well as the white middle class kids -it just is... this is a fact. You should go to some of these soccer tournaments that my brother plays in... its unreal. thousands of kids, hundreds of team, from all over the US - and it happens literally every weekend in hundreds of cities, year-round.

-MLS, 10 teams to 20 in 16 years. not bad. still expanding.

Will soccer overtake football or baseball? not any time soon. Will its growing popularity continue at an accelerated rate? definitely. We will get the 2022 world cup, thanks to Brad Pitt and Morgan Freeman who are on the committee, and it will be huge. (by the way, in 1994, the one in the US, more tickets were sold than in any other world cup... ever and still holds today)

-Yes, America bought more tickets than any other country besides S. Africa. Yes, we have a larger population, but the point is that this is the first time this has ever happened. Sam's Army and the American Outlaws (two fan groups) organized thousands of fans to go over together - its nuts. FIFA officials were shockingly surprised with US fans and made special mention of their commitment to the game about 3 months ago.

you are a dying breed profilet - its very sad.

GO USA. even if we lose today - and we probably will - it's gonna be huge.

So excited. I've been wearing my jersey for 3 days straight.

ZG$

Patrick Thomas Kohm June 12 at 9:52am
Dear Zach - You are amazing! Go USA!
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Tyler Profilet June 12 at 10:31am
Zach-

I'll break down your argument one by one as you presented it.

-Like a typical liberal, when you're wrong, you result in name calling. Being right doesn't make me jingoistic. And loving football and baseball doesn't make me a minority...it just puts me in the vast majority.

-True, you have a masters. However, Adam and I aren't a drain on the economy because we have this thing called a job. It's something you show up to every day (yes, even in the summer!) and you work at it for 40 hours a week. I'd try to explain it, but I don't think you would understand.

-Pointing to Jackson soccer being ranked 10th in the state as proof that soccer is rising in America is like me saying that the WNBA is going to be the biggest sport because the Jackson girls went to state a few years in a row...absurd.

-ESPN invested more money in this event than any other? NO WAY! I'm sure that has nothing to do with the fact that A) it's a month long B) it's in a foreign country C) They (ABC/ESPN) have full broadcasting rights. WOW!

-Cowherd and Simmons changed their tune on soccer? Right before the World Cup? When their company is promoting the tournament? SHOCKER. It's almost as if ESPN has a financial stake in their broadcasters not ripping soccer...but I'm sure that has NOTHING to do with it at all.

-I'm going to ignore the video game argument b/c that's laughable. That's like me saying the US Army is getting more recruits because people sit around and play Call of Duty all day long...you can't be serious on that one.

-ESPN bought the rights to show the games...wonderful. But let's be honest, they don't play that many games! ESPN can't buy the rights to every game in any other league b/c they play too much! Of course it's easy to sell out a home soccer match when there is only one a month! But if they played on a Tuesday night like the NBA or MLB, the average attendance would be way down. It's simple supply and demand. And don't compare this ESPN contract with the other ESPN contracts in terms of money...the SEC makes more money from it's football teams than the MLS.

-Fastest growing demographic in the US is illegals...I get that. Sure, they like soccer...but they like baseball too. In the Cardinal game last night, both starting pitchers were born in Mexico.

-Soccer is more accessible to poor kids...it requires one ball and no other equipment. That's why basketball has taken over in the inner cities...one ball and 10 people can play. So what? Poor people don't make sports run...rich people do. Sorry, the NBA isn't around because of the poor kids sitting in the nose bleeds. It's around because of the rich people sitting courtside.

-MLS is expanding? So is the WNBA. Big deal. Pat said only 6 teams were profitable last year, which means 40% of the league is LOSING MONEY! How long can that be subsidized? Plus, MLS is like the minor leagues of soccer...and Americans want the best, and the best is in Europe.

-When you need Brad Pitt and Morgan Freeman to make your pitches, that's pitiful. Look at how Obama brought the summer Olympics to Chicago! Oh...wait...nevermind.

-Sure, we buy more tickets because America has more money! Nigeria isn't going to buy the most because they're poor! Spain isn't going to buy the most because their population doesn't compare to the US! If the Super Bowl was in South Africa, Americans would buy the most tickets too. Plus, it's a once every 4 year event. If they did it every year, no way would Americans consider going. We can get behind something for a couple of weeks every 4 years...but it doesn't have the staying power of the other pro sports who have their championships every year.

-And the biggest point...America loves a winner. We suck at soccer. America doesn't like to suck, and we don't support programs that suck.

Sorry, Zach, you can love soccer all you want. In fact, I liken it to the biggest guy at JHS calling your girlfriend a name, and you try to pick a fight with him. Cute and noble, but he's still going to kick your ass. Kind of like the argument between soccer and football...just not going to happen

Adam Hosp June 12 at 11:03am
I feel very split. I really like soccer... and I want it to be popular. I just don't see it happening anytime soon.

If you look at the NBA, NFL, MLB and NHL they all share one thing in common that the MLS will never have... the best players in the world. I'm not sure that the MLS will ever be able to field the best players in the world... they will always stay in Europe because they don't respect American soccer.

Zachary Garrison June 12 at 12:04pm
In response to Profilet:

Predictably, you twisted my points to make them fit your own skewed perspective - you should work at Fox News.

1) when I said your demographic was literally becoming a minority, that was not in reference to baseball fans, but literally your status as a middle class white male. This was the first year ever that over 50% of American born babies (making them legal by the way) were born to minority parents - and in the coming decades there will no longer be a white majority in the United States. This is of course due to the Latino population, who overwhelmingly prefer soccer. Your absolutely wrong if you think baseball is more popular in Mexico than soccer... it is not even close. I just don't see a lot of of Latinos playing in the NBA or NFL either.

-the final issue here is that, yes, soon enough you will not be in the majority. I know this scares you...

2) I work more than 40 hours a week and I get paid, very little, but enough to live one. I probably work more and harder than you ( have you written a Master's Thesis recently while teaching two classes and taking two classes?). I also have a full ride scholarship. When I get my PhD I will make more more money than you and I will work 9 months out of the year and work much less. Also, you will have to call me Doctor Garrison.

3) You focused on the Jackson aspect, but the main point of that paragraph was to say that change happens incrementally. No sport emerges and becomes uber successful in a few years. No one can deny that soccer has become much much much more popular in the last 16 years, it's ridiculous to think it will just stop gaining momentum.

4) With ESPN you are ignoring the crucial point: 16 years ago ESPN did not give a shit about US Soccer. 2002 they broadcasted every single game - 2010 they invest more money in advertising and promotion than any other sporting event. Why? Well you admit it's due to money, but how do they make so much money off of soccer? Because it is very very popular in the United states. More and more people are watching it = more and more people enjoy soccer, more fans, more players, bigger game.

5) How can you ignore the video game argument? If all of a sudden tennis was the most popular video game in the United States would you just dismiss it and say, " Oh well people don't really play that much tennis generally in the United States but boy oh boy do they love to play the video." Do you honestly think there is not a direct cultural correlation between a leisure activity like a soccer video game and the popularity of a sport? Really? People bought Air Jordans because they just liked cool shoes I guess... had nothing to do with the fact that everyone liked Jordan.

6) With buying the rights to the English Premiere League, once again, you don't know what you are talking about. Espn bought the rights to EVERY GAME - like the NFL and Sundays and Mondays, the EPL plays every Tuesday night and every Saturday and Sunday - ESPN plays every game onSaturday and Sundays morning live - the reason = because so many people woke up at 8:00 AM to watch those game on the Fox Soccer Channel that espn decided to get in on the rapidly expanding market in the US.

7) The census only counts legal immigrants and then makes an estimation of illegal. Even if they ignore illegal immigration and only count legal immigrants they are still the fastest growing demographic in the United States. Once again, while baseball is popular in Mexico and Central America, no one except people who have no clue about Latin America (see Tyler Profilet) think it is more popular than soccer. seriously - it's not even close.

8) My point about race and class - which, once again you pulled out one aspect and spun your own argument, was much more simple: Middle class white kids do not play in the NBA or have aspirations to, they don't really play College basketball either. African Americans are over-represented in both sports ( have you seen the NBA finals???). Now, take middle class white kid's parents who invest thousands in traveling soccer teams in hopes that their kids play in college and you have a whole class of Americans who are invested in soccer - not basketball or football. It's very simple and largely irrefutable. Now - combine this with the the fastest growing demographic of of the American youth = which we have already established is latino Americans.

9) The MLS, as a league, does very well. That's why over half the teams have already built their own soccer specific stadiums and more are being built in the next 5 years. Because the league is doing so well, MLS is going to expand by two more teams in the next two years. Individual markets may struggle - like the Pittsburg Pirates, but the league is very strong.

10) The US will get the World Cup in 2022, it is almost a given. Why? because, as I said last time, WC 1994 (in US) broke records for attendance, which still hold today.

11) We don't suck at soccer. We are in the World Cup ranked in the top 15 in the world. And we just beat Spain in the Confederations Cup last year.

-America also loves an underdog - see every sporting event ever. The Mighty Ducks were underdogs against Iceland ...look what happened.

The problem here is that a certain group of people - like Profilet - are scared of soccer - it's a sport they don't understand and can't analyze. I love football and baseball and basketball, but I also love soccer. I see it as not a competition between soccer and football but rather as the rise of another great American sport. Conservative people fear change - like slave owners in the south - but inevitably they always get left behind. I just wish I could bring you along for the ride Profilet, I think we all feel a little bit bad that you are so ignorant to the most popular sport in the world. hang in there man.

Patrick Thomas Kohm June 12 at 4:37pm
Most Conservatives Zach... Or I would except Extreme Conservatives...

Tyler Profilet June 12 at 4:45pm
First of all, I don't care how many degrees you have, I'm never calling you doctor...ever. I think it's great that you study the War of Northern Aggression and can make money doing so.

However, we're not talking about politics or war...we're talking about television and sports. And guess what? That's my area of expertise, considering I kind of do television for a living. So please, don't pretend to know as much about television contracts or money in sports as I do, b/c it's my livelyhood. Grant, slavery, Missouri Compromise = Zach. Sports, television, money = Tyler.

First of all, the reason there is any level of soccer in the U.S. above high school is because of football. College soccer would not exist at any Division 1 level without football subsidizing it. Hey, soccer isn't the only sport that lives of the coattails of football (every other sport except men's basketball does too), but you can't argue the current popularity...just not even close. The Big 10 isn't accepting Nebraska because of the volleyball program, ok? So all the soccer you watch on the collegiate (d-1) level.

Soccer becoming more popular in the past 16 years...sure, I can't deny that...but it's not keeping pace with the growing popularity of the other big 3 sports in America. MLB is breaking attendance records every year, and the NFL is the most profitable it has ever been (and b/c of this, it's probably leading to a lock out). To become a factor in the American sports landscape, soccer will have to surpass either football, basketball, or baseball...and I'll let you tell me which one it's going to pass. Those three sports take Americans through the entire year, so it's not like soccer has it's own "season" or a couple of months it can be #1 without compeition. To make big $$$, it's going to have to beat out one of the three, and even the most optimistic soccer fan can't say that's a reasonable expectation.

Stop with the video game bullshit. You bring up tennis...what about Wii Sports?!?! It's sold millions! Wait, that doesn't mean bowling and tennis are taking over baseball? Ridiculous argument Zach...and please, don't compare FIFA video games to Michael Jordan. That's quite a leap to brand a #2 rated video game to the most marketable athlete in history.

In television, 8AM isn't a prime spot. You probably don't know this, but creating programming is much cheaper than syndicating a show. So, sure, Fox makes more money off showing a soccer game than they would a rerun of Seinfeld...b/c it's cheaper! Also, at 8AM on a Saturday has little viewing competition...it's not like ABC was broadcasting the NBA Finals at that time. Soccer has never had to compete head-to-head for TV ratings against a major US sport. So when you mention TV ratings, keep those factors in mind...they look good, but they are totally skewed.

Also, speaking the minorities. First of all, nice racial jokes...really makes your point stronger. Secondly, not all viewers are worth the same amount of money...for example...

Do you know who the highest paid athlete in the world was last year (including endorsements)? Tiger Woods...easy to guess, right? Know who #2 was? Phil Mickelson. Shocker...guy isn't even the best at his own sport, but pocketed a cool $60 mil last year. Well how could this be? Golf isn't as popular in the US as football, baseball, basketball...or even arguably soccer! But it's because TV advertisers are not created equal. Let me explain...

When you watch golf, what kind of ads do you see? ING, Prudential, New York Life, Lexus, etc...Wall Street companies and luxury items. Why? B/c rich, white men play and watch golf...they buy that stuff. Now watch soccer...what do you see? Nike, Coke, McDonalds...stuff middle class and even poor people can afford. Guess which ads sell at a higher price? The golf ads, duh. Even though more people may watch the NBA Finals or World Series, the Masters advertising time is wayyyyy more valuable.

Why do I bring this up? Well, it's because of money, which is what this is all about. ESPN will ALWAYS prefer to show a major golf (or even tennis) tournament over soccer? Why? They make more money! ESPN can buy all the Premier League matches they want b/c A) they don't have to compete against any other major sports in that time slot (tape delayed or early morning b/c of the time difference). B) One golf viewer is worth about 10x more than one soccer viewer. That's just the economics. C) ESPN doesn't show the games b/c all the people wake up to watch...it's just cheaper and easier for them to make money b/c of the time slot. Sorry, but that's television.

Zach probably doesn't know that my Dad is a regional director for the Census Bureau...so yeah...I know plenty about that too...probably much more than you.

People like me aren't scared of soccer...it poses no threat to the sports I like. What I hate is soccer fans getting all jazzed up one month every four years saying, "oh, soccer is going to be big...just wait." Well guess what, we've waited...and waited...and waited...and it's just not happening. MLS can survive...sure, why not? But it will never be as big as the big 3 American sports...it will be (at best) like the NHL. Something in the back of our mind, but never in the front...and MLS and soccer fans should consider that a great success.

Patrick Thomas Kohm June 12 at 5:22pm
Doesn't Wii sports come free with the console?

And Tyler, Zach and I never got all jazzed up on you about this topic and shoved it down your throat... you brought this up saying... "World Cup has started. Ok America, let's pretend like we care for the next month then we get to ignore soccer for four more years." Its almost as if you take it personal... Since the WC started advertising, I've heard more people dissing soccer than I have soccer fans saying "soccer is going to be huge in the US, American football fans better watch out!"

I get every sport shoved down my throat every time it has a huge event... that's TV... but because I enjoy every sport, play every sport, I can watch every sport, I love the attention - whether its March Madness, NBA Finals, Wimbleton, Masters, SuperBowl - I can't get enough, I love sports.

I think you just need to be a little more aware of the people you alienate when you say stuff like that - because Soccer being my favorite sport to view and play, I take it personal. I'm not a sensitive person, but I am proud of Soccer and the progress it has made in America.

I can also say, it is impossible to predict the success of soccer in America - but we can agree that for a country who's fastest growing demographic is in love with soccer, there is a good chance that the layout of sports in the future could look different with that fact alone.

Tyler Profilet June 12 at 5:46pm
First, I didn't direct that comment to you or Zach...I was just saying what I thought, you had the option to respond or let it roll off your back.

Secondly, I'm shocked you let this hurt your feelings. I'm sorry that it did...never my intention. The fact that I don't like soccer doesn't mean I don't like you or I think your dumb, suck, gay, whatever. I don't take it personally...I mean, when Zach says I'm a racist, jingoisitc, right-winger...that I take personally...not soccer/football/etc.

Pat, of course sports get promoted. I get that...it's smart. If people don't know about the event, they won't watch. The point I'm making, is that it's my opinion (and of many others) that many soccer fans are obnoxious, and for the lack of a better term, don't know their place. I think the average Joe sports fan can get behind the World Cup. But when soccer fans try to say "this is the next big thing...we're taking over!" That rubs people the wrong way, especially when we've heard it all before, and it hasn't happened. It's like the boy who cried wolf. It's like soccer fans feel the need to "prove" their sport belongs instead of letting people just accept it, and I feel like that's where the backlash comes from. And I'm not saying you and Zach do this...but you have to understand that perception is not always reality, and the perception of average Joe sports fans is that soccer fans are obnoxious, young, and "hipster." That doesn't go over well with the SEC football fan or Chicago Bulls fan. Americans like sports where we can relate to the athletes...and we can't relate to the best soccer players in the world. They're not from here, they don't look like us, talk like us, act like us...and that's why it's not watched as often, not as marketable, and will not take over any of the big 3 american sports.

It's not personal, but I'm not insulting the game you created...you just played it. I played it. Hell, I was a FIFA certified offical. But you can't say with a straight face that soccer will break into the big realm of sports. I thought I complemented soccer when I said it can be as big as the NHL...but to compare it to the big 3 is not reasonable

Patrick Thomas Kohm June 12 at 6:09pm
My feelings weren't hurt.. I'm just passionate about the sport I love and will stick up for it when it is attacked... If that's obnoxious, then so be it...
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Zachary Garrison June 13 at 10:38am
Wow, just when I think you reached the limit on ridiculousness you go one step further. This is silly ... but fun.

last few things:

You really need to drop the Fox News tactics - you take snippets of what I say and then twist them to the point that its no longer recognizable. example: you said "I mean, when Zach says I'm a racist, jingoisitc, right-winger...that I take personally...not soccer/football/etc." Never, not once, did I call you a racist - you just made that up!!!!! On the other points, yes, you are in fact one of the most right-wing leaning individuals I know.

next example: I talked about the census only to make the point that even if you ignore illegal immigration, then Latino Americans are still the fastest growing demographic in the US --- now SOMEHOW you take this to mean that I am challenging your knowledge on the census and act like a 5th grader by touting your dad's experience with the census... that doesn't make any sense!!! What are you even talking about???


-next point: somehow, you decided that I was questioning your credentials in television and sports ...I have no idea why you are so self conscious about this. Given, I am not sure covering Meth labs in Southeast Missouri makes you an expert in sports, but I never said "Profilet let me tell you about television." The thing I did say was that you are ignorant about soccer.... which you are.


- next: you said, "First of all, nice racial jokes...really makes your point stronger." the irony here is rich, since after meeting you my fiance noted your blatant racism after saying the N word several times. Please note, contrary to what you believe this is the first time I have connected the word racism and your name. I have no clue what this is in reference to, I never made a racist joke, I was stating the obvious - latinos do not play basketball and football - that's not racist, it's a fact!!! Or if you are talking about the NBA finals, then, once again, I was stating an obvious fact!!! It's like you read what I write and then your brain filters out what it wants to.


-the biggest point of all here is that never...never...never did either Pat or myself suggest that soccer was more popular than baseball/basketball/football... never. Though, SOMEHOW, that's what you took away form it. All we said was -soccer is way more popular than you give it credit for. Saying something stupid like Americans can pretend to care about soccer again obviously is going to provoke people who care deeply and have been waiting for four years all for this one month. which by the way, worst apology ever= "First, I didn't direct that comment to you or Zach...I was just saying what I thought, you had the option to respond or let it roll off your back.

Secondly, I'm shocked you let this hurt your feelings. I'm sorry that it did...never my intention." .........so sincere.

I'll repeat what I said at the end of my last message because I guess you didn't read it: "The problem here is that a certain group of people - like Profilet - are scared of soccer - it's a sport they don't understand and can't analyze. I love football and baseball and basketball, but I also love soccer. I see it as not a competition between soccer and football but rather as the rise of another great American sport." I don't care if soccer is more popular than football - I'm sure it never will be - what Pat and I care about is that it continues to becomes more and more popular - which it undoubtedly is.

now go watch the oh so awesome NBA finals, while me and Pat embrace the world.


Bottom Line: Profilet sucks and me and Pat rule.

Tyler Profilet June 13 at 9:19pm
"Conservative people fear change - like slave owners in the south" -
"noted your blatant racism"

If that doesn't imply racist, please let me know what you meant by that. Call me that all you want, but you know as well and anyone else there's a difference between being racist and just saying ridiculous things to make someone laugh. You obviously know I wasn't serious.

You like soccer...I get it. I don't like soccer, but it's not like I haven't tried to watch it. I remember going to McNally's with you on more than one occasion to watch soccer...I just couldn't get into it. I'm not some fan who just dismissed it without trying to like it. I put forth the effort and the sport didn't grab my attention.

I'm not self conscious about knowing about television...you were just spouting off numbers about TV ratings and contracts to prove soccer is getting big in the U.S. And what I was saying, is that's not necessarily the case. There are lots of reasons other than growing popularity to pick up programming like that. Remember, ESPN shows bowling, cheerleading, and softball too...doesn't mean popularity is growing, it's just easier/cheaper to produce that programming.

Soccer's popularity is growing...I said before I can't deny that and I won't. But you also can't deny it won't make it big in the U.S. for the same reason hockey isn't big anymore...the other sports take Americans through the whole year, and it can't compete with them for TV revenue.

I guess where we disagree is on the definition of "big." I don't think soccer will make it "big" b/c I only consider 3 sports to be "big" in the U.S. If you think being big is being comparable to hockey...then yeah, I guess soccer can be big...but even then, the sport has a long way to go.

I think Pat and Zach rule too...but soccer doesn't rule here.

Adam Hosp June 14 at 8:35pm
I just want to point out... this has been more entertaining than most internet threads. I suggest we pick a new topic every week...

Patrick Thomas Kohm June 14 at 11:14pm
I agree with Adam... we should have a round table and tape it... I think it would be hilarious... I wonder if we can get Mark Summers to mediate?

Adam Hosp June 17 at 10:09pm
Good evening. So I certainly don't want to keep this going... but I was listening to a podcast today, and I thought they made an interesting point.

The "big 4" American sports (and even Golf and other fringe sports) all have a lot of commercials. I'd say the "worst offender" is certainly the NFL. We all know that the real money in sports comes from advertising on TV. That means if you increase the amount of commercials, you should be able to increase your TV revenue. The way soccer is structured, you don't have commercials in the traditional sense. THe point was made on the podcast that advertisers and TV networks in America have a vested interest in keeping soccer less popular - simply because it would generate less profit for them (for TV networks, at least). From an advertising point of view... even if a lot of people watch Soccer, they would have a less-captive audience than say, the NFL.

Like I said - it was just something I heard, and I wanted to ask your opinion.

Also - you all should check out this book: http://www.amazon.com/Soccernomics-Australia-Turkey-Iraq-Are-Destined/dp/1568584253

Soccernomics: Why England Loses, Why Germany and Brazil Win, and Why the U.S., Japan, Australia, Tur
www.amazon.com
Why do England lose? Why does Scotland suck? Why doesn’t America dominate the sport internationally...and why do the Germans play with such an efficient but robotic style? These are questions every soccer aficionado has asked. Soccernomics answers them. Using insights and analogies from econom...
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Tyler Profilet June 17 at 10:54pm
That's a great point, Adam. Very similar with what you see in NASCAR. Fortunately for NASCAR, they can load up the cars with ads...can't do that in soccer. However, you see ads taking over the jerseys instead of putting the team name on the front. I think that's a revenue stream you'll see soccer explore more in the future.

I would disagree that advertisers have a vested interest in keeping soccer down. Advertisers don't care if it's the world scrabble championships...if people watch, money can be made. However, NASCAR and golf don't have planned commercial breaks, but races and golf rounds take 3.5 hours...soccer is 90 minutes. I think I tried to make the point before, and I'll say it again. Soccer is growing in popularity, but the disparity in revenue between soccer and the other big 3 (or 4) is still increasing, and thus it won't ever be as successful as those sports

Patrick Thomas Kohm June 18 at 12:40am
Well... Soccer is successful and CAN make ungodly revenues (see the rest of the world). And to act like it is impossible for this to happen in the US is ridiculous... its already happening all over the world!!

As Zach and I pointed out; as the landscape of the US population continues to change, the MLS continues to prosper, children who play the most popular recreational sport grow up, hillbillies die, Popular sports networks bring more soccer games into US homes, the National team continues to improve and excel in the World Cup/overseas, there is a good chance that, in time (this could be 30 yrs or even 200, idk), that we will see the rise of another great sport in America.